Wednesday, May 7, 2008

One Up, One Down

Maybe you overpriced your home. Everyone does it, at least to start. No shame there.

The next move, eventually, is to trim a bit. See if that builds interest. And if not, cut again.

This seems elementary, and it’s the strategy pursued recently by 923 1st (click address for pics & details via Redfin), a Hill Section listing that began in early 2008 at a whopping $8m (-$2k). (See our review in “Unpredictable.”)

By late March, with no takers, the sellers cut $403k (-5%) to $7.595m.

That did not do the trick. The next step was to take another $220k off the top on April 28. Now the listing was down to $7.375m, as we noted in our MB Market Update the other day.

Just a few days later, however, a second listing of 923 1st began on a different MLS (SoCal MLS), and that one began at $7.595m, the old price.

No, they couldn’t be increasing the price, we figured. We chalked it up to some kind of anomaly or clerical error. The local MLS listing (on Mr. MLS) stayed at $7.375m.

And then it got strange. Tuesday, the local listing did, in fact, bump back up to $7.595m. (Graphic via the Redfin listing.) So it appears that the seller had a kind of seller's regret, and potential buyers missed an unannounced 10-day sale.

This is a strategy to sell the home?

We saw a chaotic listing like this last year. In the Tree Section, 579 29th started in December 2006 at $2.575m, dropped to $2.4m, rose to $2.519m, cut again to $2.329m and eventually sold in August 2007 for $2.250m (-$350k/-13% from start). (See stories here and here.)

The bump up did not speed the sale or net the sellers any more money, but for those critical days or weeks when they were driving the pricing, perhaps the move might have helped them dream bigger. Before reality interceded.

Meanwhile, some more conventional pricing behavior is on display over at 225 Homer. That one began at $2.3m in late March.

Last weekend, as we noted in our Weekend Opens column, the price online was still posted as $2.3m – but the open-house listings said it was $2.1m.

We kinda knew that cut was coming for real, so we lightheartedly urged readers to clip the BR listings as a coupon for $200k off last weekend. Alas, discounts usually make their way to the list price of things, no coupons necessary.

We expect the same, one of these days, up at 923 1st.

49 comments:

Anonymous said...

Yeah, I really do think this house is over priced by A LOT. For that price, you could snag a Strand fixer or a very nice South End WS pad. Those areas hold their value better than Hill estates.

Anonymous said...

I agree with 6:27. Sand/Strand lots hold their value compared to the Hill and Tree sections. Also, if you need extra money (unlikely for someone buying an 8mil house), sand homes can be rented out for the summer for more than enough money to pay the mortgage. I live in SB County and rent a strand/walk street house on MB or HB every summer. I split it, but the total cost ends up being 4-6K/week!! This of course depends on the house, property view, proximity, amenities, etc, etc.

What I am saying is I would much rather prefer living in the sand section area to the Hills because if you can't have a lawn, you might as well have the beach close.

Anonymous said...

Agreed - you could use a sand house as a vacation place. Can't really do that with the Hills/Trees.

Anonymous said...

Speaking of sand section, just got notice that 316 10th street is in foreclosure. Uh oh.

Anonymous said...

CNBC just ran a story about "Million Dollar Homes" and how the prices are falling faster than in sub-Million dollar markets. They cited, specifically, Greenwich, Connecticut.

The gist of the story, however, was that Jumbo loans are getting more expensive and harder to get. Lenders are requiring 25% and even 30% down and requiring borrowers to "still" have some extra cash in the bank. Rates for these loans are going up.

Of course, Manhattan Beach is probably insulated from market conditions.

alan ventures said...

I forgot to add to my posting (looking for a seller for a Home in South MB for <$2M) that...

...North Hermosa is also a great option as our kids our now at Mira Costa.

I have taken my prior post and pasted into a blog posting you should be able to access by clicking my name above.

And as i said prior i am ok with agents.

Anonymous said...

Alan Ventures -

The Hermosa walk streets are a great bargain compared with MB. They, however, are generally not sloped and the town itself is not as nice.

check the mls and good luck

Anonymous said...

I have a question, folks. I want to move to Manhattan beach from San Francisco. Don't worry, I'm not a crazy hippie.....just want nicer weather.


All I'm asking is how the MB beach treats dogs. I have 2 bigger dogs, want to live in the sand section (no yard). Can you walk them during the day? Off leash? Hours?

Thanks for your help everyone

Anonymous said...

You can walk your dogs at all hours of the day. In fact, it's not uncommon to see people out walking their dogs at extremely odd hours, like 3 or 4AM...

Timothy617 said...

Hey Crazy Hippie! jk ;)

This link should help you out.

http://www.citymb.info/
Index.aspx?page=840&categoryid=41

If the link doesn't work, go to FAQ for Animals.

Hope this helps.

Anonymous said...

Insane. But Greenspan has it right...today Alan "said house prices still had a long way to fall and that it was unlikely they would stabilize by year-end"

When will people who really want to sell wake up? LOL

Anonymous said...

12:00 p.m.

We have many many dogs in this town. Some people call them their home. But they are nasty renters.

Anonymous said...

My Dog loves Manhattan Beach. Lots of great places to walk - town, strand, greenbelt, etc. BUT - there is no place in town where dogs can be off leash. Well, there is what we call the "dog strip" which is a 10x90 fenced in dirt patch, but that is likely not what you have in mind. An easy drive to the Santa Monica Mountains though, with hundreds of miles of hiking trails that are dog friendly. And, I'm sure I'm not the only one who takes a dog out to the beach at night once people (and lifeguards) are gone. Just pick up after yourself please.

Anonymous said...

MBC, you should launch a similar blog for hermosa, or at least North Hermosa. The latter in particular is a glaring absence here. North Hermosa is a great area, an easy walk to downtown Manhattan Beach and the beach and is seeing much activity. Just a thought...

MBWatcher said...

4:07 - There's a lot I "should" do or, more to the point, would like to do. The problem is retaining interns. They work for free, but they keep going on extended surfing breaks.

Anonymous said...

Please !!! Please !!! Leave Hermosa alone. Let all the snobs and pretentious people live in Manhattan. Leave the beach people alone in Hermosa.

Anonymous said...

North Hermosa is the best of Manhattan (proximity to downtown shopping, nice clean neighborhood) and the best of Hermosa (non pretentious, still feels like a real beach community). AND...you can easily walk to BOTH piers and downtown areas. Great value in that neighborhood, IMO.

Anonymous said...

My dog is very well trained and will stay put when she is told. All she likes to do is sleep outside during the day on the porch (off leash).

Do you think this would be OK in the south end sand section? I would pick up after her, this wouldn't replace walks.

Anonymous said...

Your dog can do whatever he likes on YOUR porch. God Bless America.

MBWatcher said...

Intriguing – 923 1st has an ad in the new BR, the large caption says: "Owner Will Consider Trade for Manhattan Beach Walkstreet Property."

Anonymous said...

6 new listings in MB on the Shorewood site today. 6... in one day, ha! Even Shorewood usually controls inventory better than this!
What gets me though is how one idiot agent can even dare list a 900 and some odd sf place for 1.5! Ha (again) what does she think this is, 2005?! I know, I know...it IS MB though right? Ha (again ...and again).
Do you hear that? I know you do...it's sellers coming to the market baby, more and more every day and ooops...out of buyers? (aka No more people with access to easy money)

Ha! Vindication! To all you smug a-holes that called me a hovel owner, a "renter" and jealous of my well heeled neighbors...to all you that snubbed me for not belonging to your little "club" and treating me like some kind of outsider because I passed on the punch that was going around...how does it feel?
Wait, answer me in a year after you've had time to digest the coming shit storm.
We are going to look back at this period of RE history around here and people are going to say, OMG can you believe they paid 3 million for a builder house? Geez, WHAT WERE THEY THINKING!!!!!!!

David said...

Maybe someone could provide some Anger Management Therapy for Anon 9:42? MBC, the blog is helpful and the comments are mostly funny and certainly thought-provoking. But is it necessary for the comments section to be peppered by rants of crazed, obviously insecure lunatics?

One other thing. Anyone have any good tips or sources for buying pre-foreclosure/foreclosure properties in MB?

Anonymous said...

9:51, Here's a tip on buying foreclosure property in Manhattan Beach - Wait, it'll be cheaper in a year or two.

Anonymous said...

Looks like 9:42 forgot to take his meds today.

Anonymous said...

9:42pm - how does what feel? any drop in values doesn't change the fact that you are a loser renter! that was one of the funniest comments i've read in a while.

Huggy said...

I'm going to nominate 9:42 as press seecretary for the Cult of the Clueless. Whenever the COTC wants to announce some bogus propaganda or fake facts about the local RE market, I want 9:42 to prepare the press release. His rant was positively priceless.

Can I get a second?

Oh, and 9:51, there aren't any tips for buying foreclosure properties in MB because there are virtually no foreclosures. Sorry to disappoint.

Anonymous said...

If you seriously think this market is going anywhere but south in the next year you need to do the following 2 things:

get a better therapist than 9:42

consider another career besides real estate

laterrrrrrr little immune market.

Anonymous said...

Huggy = Realtor that enjoyed to good times, overspent, is now extremely scared he wont be able to cover his car lease and rent, and obviously has way too much time on his hands.

You are seriously the most pathetic blogger on this site. At least the other bloggers see that this is a joke and roll with the punches rather than going on incoherent rants and regurgitating the same subjective data points.

I am guessing there will be a whole group of "home owners" asking you to continue your valiant fight to over power the COTC. When in reality, you represent the PROM (Pathetic Realtors of Manhattan).

Anonymous said...

7:24am You're just angry because you weren't popular enough to go to the PROM.

Anonymous said...

Hermosa Beach will always be a stepchild. The Manhattan Beach wannabes move to North Hermosa when they can and that is close enough for me. Manhattan Beach should just annex Hermosa Beach one day and turn it into the worlds largest dog park. We whould hardly notice the difference.

Anonymous said...

Many people in Hermosa Beach refer to Manhattan Beach as the buffer zone between them and all the toxicity on MB's north end.

Anonymous said...

9:57 a.m.

Pretty early for a bong even for a Hermosa Beach dweller.

Anonymous said...

8:11am - I am guessing you didn't go to the prom.

MBW, you should have a poll as to which of your bloggers is the most pathetic.

Or a poll on which MB realtor is the most pathetic. I am guessing either poll will lead to Huggy.

Anonymous said...

10:19 a.m.

Huggy is right on most of the time. You on the other hand are never right. Keep trying though. Keep up the excellent commentary Huggy !!!!!!!!

Anonymous said...

10:29 = Huggy

Anonymous said...

a little insecure there 9:43? It's interesting - I read this blog for a couple months when moving out here from Texas earlier this year as we were looking in MB - ultimately we found our best deal in the north Hermosa sand. I guess we could have paid less for other properties in parts of MB that had much less desirable location in our opinion, but ultimately we were comfortable enough in our skin to not require a 90266 zip code to enjoy the benefits of this area.

Personally, I love the area we live in and could care less whether I could have moved 3 or 4 blocks over and been in MB - But I also didn't avoid MB specifically either just because of the superiority complex of a few bad apples - it just turned out that I thought we got the best deal for our money in north HB and am very happy to be here (beats the heck out of north Texas).

Anonymous said...

10:19am -agreed on the poll. my vote goes to anonymous (10:19am in particular).

Anonymous said...

9:43- Yeah I would rather live on Pacific, Rosecrans or El Porto than Hermosa Sand/Valley or the Strand just for the schools and 90266 address. What an as-inine comment, you idiot. Go ahead and delete MBW, but 9:43 is truly an idiot.

Anonymous said...

It's the attitudes of people like 9:43 that will make MB less and less desirable to sane people.

I really like both cities, but the almighty 90266 attitude is a little much at times and makes me lean to HB...much more laid back.

Anonymous said...

11:28 a.m.

Don't get your panties in a twist there Mary. I was just stating the obvious. I live in PVE.

Anonymous said...

if i am looking to rent a house for a month in the summer, and i look at the border between MB and HB, how much of a rental price difference is there between a house two blocks south of the border in HB and two blocks north of the border in MB ?

Anonymous said...

three words

vrbo dot com

this will have everything
-----------------------------

also check westside rentals

Anonymous said...

hey mbwatcher:

please post something on this site to tell how many users visit per day/per week, etc.

This would really help all you supporters (or enemies) tell exactly how influential you are in this town.

I would appreciate it.

MBWatcher said...

My techie friends say I should keep this info close, but I'll offer a good raw number – 31,000 visits in April.

Sorry, I don't think I'll break it down further unless you're buying advertising ;)

Anonymous said...

21,000 of those visits were from mookie giving us his latest technical analysis of MB real estate using Japanese candlestick chart patterns.

Anonymous said...

I totally agree that North Hermosa is the best kept secret in the south bay. What a bargain vs. south manhattan. Schools are just as good, plus the town allows roof decks on new construction.

Anonymous said...

6:04 p.m.

Wow, roof decks. Maybe even out houses in some areas.

Anonymous said...

I'm confused. What do outhouses have to do with ocean view roof decks?

Epsilon said...

Do the personalities on this board actually reflect the personalities of people in MB, face to face? If I started renting down there, would dogs crap on my door step and owners on the strand drop off pamphlets in my mailbox saying, "renter, go home!"

I assumed the haughty attitude online is largely a product of anonymity...

 

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